Printing Questions

Requests for new features, question how to do something etc...

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gwport
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Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2006 5:28 pm

Printing Questions

Post by gwport » Wed Jul 26, 2006 4:04 pm

GW 2.1.24, W98SE/German.

1) Command Print, checkbox All Diagrams in Game: When I use this feature, the first of several diagrams in a simple game (Print View) is NOT printed. Am I doing something wrongly or is this just a bug?

2) After exactly two successive passes, the board shows some sort of scoring automatically. How do I print the current diagram incl. the second successive pass (or this diagram as one of the All Diagrams in Game) WITHOUT the territory markups (which are especially nasty upon move numbers)?
robert jasiek

lpaatero
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Post by lpaatero » Wed Jul 26, 2006 9:16 pm

<b>1</b>: Sounds like a bug. Could you send me file with problem?

<b>2</b>: The scoring is stored SGF file, GOWrite does not produce automatically anything like that. You can do one of
  • delete scoring: Delete button near territory calculation.
    Move it to variation (so it does not appear in diagram).
    Add extra diagram before territory calculation (and discard it).
regards

Lauri

gwport
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Post by gwport » Wed Jul 26, 2006 9:57 pm

lpaatero wrote:
>>Could you send me file with problem?<<

Done.

>>
The scoring is stored SGF file, GOWrite does not produce automatically anything like that.
<<

Ok.

>>delete scoring: Delete button near territory calculation.<<

Ah, thx, very useful!

>>Add extra diagram before territory calculation (and discard it).<<

I am too stupid for that. It always puts the diagram BEFORE the second successive pass but I want that in the diagram together with the other previous ca. 50 moves.
robert jasiek

lpaatero
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Post by lpaatero » Thu Jul 27, 2006 6:16 pm

I looked at SGF files you sent. There is no actual bug, but this is trap (eg bad usability).

Problem is simple: There is no diagram at the start of game. And solution is to add one to start of game (just <b>insert->diagram</b> at the start of game).

This problem happens, as GOWrite adds diagram to start of SGF file it creates, so if file is created using GOWrite, no problem occus. But not all programs add diagram, so then one needs to add.

This reminds me that I planned to automatically add diagram to start of game, if no diagrams are found from file. I will do this soon in GOWrite 2.2. (Also the Print Wizard in 2.2 solves most common traps like this when preparing to print commented game.)

regards

Lauri

gwport
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Post by gwport » Thu Jul 27, 2006 7:43 pm

IIRC, SGF does not require to put a diagram into the root node. Therefore GW should also count correctly if user enters diagrams only later.
robert jasiek

lpaatero
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Post by lpaatero » Thu Jul 27, 2006 8:39 pm

True, SGF does not require diagram in root.

But then GOWrite is doing what you asked: You did not add diagram into root, so GOWrite did not produce diagram. So no bug. But bad usability, as you had to ask for help, and you are not only one who had been bitten by this issue.

regards

Lauri

gwport
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Post by gwport » Thu Jul 27, 2006 9:48 pm

I rather approached the issue from a user's view: The program promises (in the checkbox option) that it would print all diagrams in the game but it does not keep its promise. I do not care for the reason in the program code or in SGF but the program should simply fulfil its (nice!) promise.
robert jasiek

lpaatero
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Post by lpaatero » Fri Jul 28, 2006 10:07 am

So you would prefer that gowrite invents new diagram(s), so that all moves are included in some of diagram? Do you think same rule should be applied to variations, so that all moves in variations are visible in some diagram?

Reason I have not done these so far, is that I prefer to minimize things done behind scenes, as these automatic things usually need also ways to turn them off, and this adds even more options that people do not find them without help (eg even more bad usablity).

My approach in 2.2 is to offer tool (print wizard) to create most common default setups of diagrams easily, and then allow free customization. This way if one is doing just basic commented game printing, it is really easy and fail-safe, but if one is doing fine-tuned publishing work, everything is fully adjustable.

regards

Lauri

gwport
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Post by gwport » Fri Jul 28, 2006 3:02 pm

I am beginning to understand the cause: I expected a "diagram" to be a mark that collects everything before. Actually it seems to collect everything afterwards. Thus my suggestion: GW could provide options for the Print All Diagrams command: include / exclude the game start, include / exclude the final position.
robert jasiek

agusmba
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Post by agusmba » Fri Jul 28, 2006 7:24 pm

I also had the working of diagrams backwards, but once you know how to use them, they do everything you want :-)
Check out the printing wizard, maybe there is no need to add the options you mentioned.

Regards,
Agustín.

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